The totally cool no stress US election thread

Lara

Lara

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Dave

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AdrianH

AdrianH

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Dave said:
I doubt anyone with even a small, no, miniscule modicum of knowledge expected Trump to be found guilty, there is no way 17 Republicans were going cross the floor and vote guilty...
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So you acknowledge then the Democrats have less than a miniscule modicum of knowledge as they decided to go through with the impeachment in the first place.
 
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Rudolph Hart

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AdrianH said:
So you acknowledge then the Democrats have less than a miniscule modicum of knowledge as they decided to go through with the impeachment in the first place.
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Seems you’re happy to do just about anything for a fight. Had a few beers and feeling all erudite are we?
 
Dave

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AdrianH said:
So you acknowledge then the Democrats have less than a miniscule modicum of knowledge as they decided to go through with the impeachment in the first place.
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No, not at all, the impeachment was correct and is still on Trump’s record, he actually holds the record of being the only president impeached twice.

By the way, it’s quite disingenuous to make up stuff and then claim the previous poster acknowledges your viewpoint, I’m quite disappointed to see you do that in a serious thread...
 
AdrianH

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Dave said:
No, not at all, the impeachment was correct and is still on Trump’s record, he actually holds the record of being the only president impeached twice.

By the way, it’s quite disingenuous to make up stuff and then claim the previous poster acknowledges your viewpoint, I’m quite disappointed to see you do that in a serious thread...
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Yeah, so the Democrats impeached him twice, and lost twice, and ultimately wasted time and money at the expense of the American tax payers for their own political games (see below). Excellent record for the Democrats, they must be proud of this achievement.

So lets take your "statement" that the outcome was pretty much known, but the Democrats were still happy to waste tax payers money by accusing Trump of insurrection, which was seriously over-reaching from the get go. Of course, everybody knows it was never about the insurrection though, it was all about stopping Trump having a chance of running for president again, because they fear him. So good for them wasting tax payers money on their political games .

Bonus: Nancy Pelosi is already having meltdown by crashing a press conference, lashing out and calling Republicans cowardly, calling Trump horrible, and basically just all angry and enraged. Guess she doesn't have the miniscule modicum of knowledge
 
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Dave

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AdrianH said:
Yeah, so the Democrats impeached him twice, and lost twice, and ultimately wasted time and money at the expense of the American tax payers for their own political games (see below). Excellent record for the Democrats, they must be proud of this achievement.
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It’s hardly a “wasted time and money” when it’s an established procedure in their political system.
 
Dave

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AdrianH said:
Bonus: Nancy Pelosi is already having meltdown by crashing a press conference, lashing out and calling Republicans cowardly
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Except they are cowards, listen to what Mitch McConnell had to say about Trump, and then voted to acquit...

www.theguardian.com

Mitch McConnell lambasts Donald Trump but votes not guilty in impeachment trial – video

Nancy Pelosi criticises 'cowardly' Republicans as minority leader Mitch McConnell savages Trump but votes not guilty regardless
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
 
AdrianH

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Dave said:
Except they are cowards, listen to what Mitch McConnell had to say about Trump, and then voted to acquit...

www.theguardian.com

Mitch McConnell lambasts Donald Trump but votes not guilty in impeachment trial – video

Nancy Pelosi criticises 'cowardly' Republicans as minority leader Mitch McConnell savages Trump but votes not guilty regardless
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
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I listened to what he said. The whole issue about would it be constitutional or not is still open to debate and interpretation and would need to be tested in court. Of course, McConnell delayed the whole trial in the beginning anyway by not brining the senate back from recess, so maybe he should rather say sorry, just seem too little too late in my books.

Personally, I wouldn't call those Republican senators cowards, but selfish actually. If we assume that they all felt Trump was guilty, the only reason they didn't vote guilty is because they want to look after their political careers. It's easy for them to push it to the courts instead of them having to deal with the possibility of a backlash from Republican voters by voting guilty.
 
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Paul Hjul

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AdrianH said:
I listened to what he said. The whole issue about would it be constitutional or not is still open to debate and interpretation and would need to be tested in court. Of course, McConnell delayed the whole trial in the beginning anyway by not brining the senate back from recess, so maybe he should rather say sorry, just seem too little too late in my books.

Personally, I wouldn't call those Republican senators cowards, but selfish actually. If we assume that they all felt Trump was guilty, the only reason they didn't vote guilty is because they want to look after their political careers. It's easy for them to push it to the courts instead of them having to deal with the possibility of a backlash from Republican voters by voting guilty.
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Um no

The question of impeachment jurisdiction is a definitive competence-competence question. The Senate has exclusive jurisdiction to try articles of impeachment. The Nixon (Walter, not Richard, aka the corrupt judge not the corrupt president) decisions delineate the role of the federal judiciary. As soon as the Senate had taken a decision as to competence and jurisdiction that determination was made. McConnell in true McConnell corrupt form ignored a binding decision of the Senate in order to circumvent the dignity of the Senate and ensure a breakdown in accountability.

A good primer and summary of Nixon: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nixon_v._United_States
 
AdrianH

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Paul Hjul said:
Um no

The question of impeachment jurisdiction is a definitive competence-competence question. The Senate has exclusive jurisdiction to try articles of impeachment. The Nixon (Walter, not Richard, aka the corrupt judge not the corrupt president) decisions delineate the role of the federal judiciary. As soon as the Senate had taken a decision as to competence and jurisdiction that determination was made. McConnell in true McConnell corrupt form ignored a binding decision of the Senate in order to circumvent the dignity of the Senate and ensure a breakdown in accountability.

A good primer and summary of Nixon: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nixon_v._United_States
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If the senate tried Trump instead of acquit, and Trump felt it to be unconstitutional, what happens then and who would he appeal to? I am under the understanding it would be the US Supreme Court.
 
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Paul Hjul

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he could try to appeal to SCOTUS who would dismiss motion for certiorari (and possibly cite Nixon). Trumps feelings have no bearing on anything - or at least they shouldn't. The problem is Trump supporters are little pansy snowflakes who don't want their or their Great Leader's feeling to get hurt. As a practical matter on the electorate people who decry decency and don't care for the feelings of others while expecting their irrational feelings to matter are going to be an electoral block but one which successive elections show can only impact the outcome of US elections if there is pandering to them and apportionment advantage (the argument is not that the Electoral College is a bad thing but rather that it generates an apportionment advantage). Things like felony disenfranchisement at state level (in particular where you have one set of drug crimes resulting in treatment and no felony attachment while another set of drugs results in disenfranchisement and the difference between the two sets of drug crimes is demographics - Florida is particularly poignant here - - somewhat ironically though the Miami-Dade drug court which has allowed several hundred numnuts with a hardon hatred for Hillary Clinton to evade felony disenfranchisement was setup by Janet Reno) and efforts by some states to lock out voters all feed into the problem of a profoundly undemocratic populist movement that demands apportionment advantage and when it looses resorts to feigned populism. Never confuse populism with democracy, and never assume that a cult figure has more support than the numnuts voting for them.
 
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